Untitled – November 24, 2025

00:00:00 Speaker: In the creative industry on its head. Mark and I are welcome. Kent Boswell and Marcus Tesoriero from eye Candy. Let’s go. You’ve gone from leadership leadership to leadership role in the creative space, winning cancer ward building and creating some really, really exciting content on Hollywood feature films, hundreds of television commercials, tech, augmented reality, virtual reality. For the last five years of my career has been mainly working in that creative tech space. There was so much talk around AI avatars, efficiencies in AI touching a little bit on AI film generation. Yeah, but it was kind of still laughable even back then. Like, you know, eighteen months ago, you know, Smith type stuff. Will Smith eating spaghetti, right? It’s like candy. It’s not it’s not a prompting tool. If you are a production company essentially that’s utilizing it. Yeah, we make the impossible. That’s the whole ethos is those impossible ideas can now be made. I think of it as a top tier production company. Yeah, but we don’t use any cameras forward facing and going to pioneer this new form of filmmaking. And AI is obviously that.

So now the budgets come in, they’re like, what can you do with one hundred grand? When we first started, you know, the budgets. You know, you wouldn’t get out of bed for less than two hundred grand for it to just shoot something, right. Climate change is a headline. And to be able to tell that story and get it out there and articulate climate change in a different way. So it’s visual five, six years ago and I remember pitching it, you know, at the agency I was at at the time and getting told that for a million reasons, it can’t happen to be able to tell the story visually because it’s never been able to be. It’s never been done before. It’s always been a headline or a chart or a shroud or a graph and send it over to Gary Jules, um, and his record label and thinking, honestly, we’d probably never hear back. Thirty six hours later he came back saying he loved the project I’m in and gifted us the song and oh, it’s so good. What’s your perspective on what it’s doing to the creative space? A lot of people fear change, right? And it’s kind of like there is a bit of a monumental shift in industries that are happening. So it’s very easy to go paint AI with one brush and go, it’s all bad or it’s all too much or whatever, but everything that we do is human creativity powered by AI? Efficiency. We we still need, you know, either working with brands, we come up with the ideas ourselves or with agencies, bring us a killer script and don’t quite have the budget, and we can create it. Right. You know, there’s the headline. You know, AI leads a whopping carbon footprint. Um, everything leaves a carbon footprint. Us doing the podcast today is a carbon footprint. When you compare AI film production with against traditional joint production, AI film production is far greener. And I’m talking ninety nine percent greener. Um. Let’s go. Marcus, thanks for joining us, guys. It’s a pleasure to have you here. I’ve been loving the journey that you guys have been on over the last sort of, I think six months. You’ve probably just experienced the biggest boom for your business. Almost been four months. Uh, officially. Officially, yes. But yeah, in terms of digging up our, like, the starting the business, digging up our AFM directors across the planet, that’s been an additional nine months on top of that. Yeah. Well it’s been yeah, a lot a long way in the making. But the last four months no lights on and officially launched. It’s like an iceberg, right? Like, people see this part like the official. But all the research, all the background, all the connections and stuff. Yeah, that’s that’s crazy. Like, a lot of work went in. So when we did launch, we were ready to go like that. Yeah. You know. So yeah, a lot of prep work, you know, and allowed us to then, you know, be able to launch officially. Yeah. Awesome. I mean, we’ll we’ll dive into eye candy, um, which is a really exciting product that you guys have been building. Um, I’d love to start with a bit of your backgrounds and the journey that you’ve been on. Um, because you’ve both had, uh, quite interesting career, from creative through to running and owning your own businesses and agencies. Um, like starting with yourself, Marcus. I mean, we crossed paths at DDB and many, many years ago. Um, and from there you’ve gone from, you know, leadership, leadership to leadership role in the creative space, winning cans awards, um, building and creating some really, really exciting, uh, content videos, productions. Um, yeah. Talk to me about this journey that you’ve been on since I guess we last met. I know. Well, it’s been a while. Um, and look, Ken and I both been in the, you know, big agency network kind of space for many years being at, um, you know, agencies that have, you know, uh, you know, one Ken Lion Awards, as you said, daddy face, all that type of thing, which we’ve been lucky enough to be part of as well, which is great. Like, you know, being part of that level of kind of ID ideation and craft and, um, anything from, you know, the film space to technology, etc.. And we both had like a real kind of like thirst for new technologies over that time, too.

So amongst the kind of network agencies like DDB, Ogilvy, McCann, Dentsu, etc., I’ve also spent a bit of time in, um, you know, tech based kind of agencies too. So agencies that were mobile first data first commercial architecture kind of always done that in between, like the big network agencies, just to kind of get a full spectrum like, um, and so out of artificial intelligence, obviously the next frontier. And, you know, Ken can tell you a bit about the story and how we met, but, um, and how we kind of did this kind of idea of where we got to with eye candy. But, you know, artificial intelligence is the next frontier, the next industrial revolution. And we both felt like this is the train is off and running and we either jump on or we don’t get left behind. Right. One hundred percent. Absolutely. It’s it’s jump on or be left behind. Yeah. And it’s moving so fast. Yeah. So for us it’s you know, it’s get on and pioneer this new this new frontier. What was your background uh in the space. Yeah. So my background similar to Marcus, you know, working at, you know, all the big agency, big networks. Um, my career almost dissects into two sections. The first section, which is working on Hollywood feature films. Wow. Big end productions, you know, from a post-production point of view. Visual effects. Um, and then the other half is, you know, advertising. And, um, so I’ve worked on Hollywood feature films, hundreds of television commercials, tech, augmented reality, virtual reality. Um, and I guess, you know, probably for the last five years of my career has been mainly working in that creative tech space, um, and always looking to, you know, find the kernel of a creative idea and push it right to the edge. I have to say, you know, like, take an idea and take take it to the edge and play in that sweet spot just before it breaks, you know? And that’s when you’re doing really interesting work with that potentially hasn’t been done before world class. And it’s going to, you know, capture the attention of the consumer. So look for Marcus and I obviously, you know AI as Marcus said is that next frontier. And we’ve gone boots and all in which is great. Fantastic. How did you guys uh meet you mentioned. You know that. So. So haven’t always been connected. How long ago was that? How did that kind of happen? Was it because of AI or. Well, look, we’ve known each other in the industry for, oh, God. What, over ten years? Okay. Um, and I guess, you know, back going back to where I came from, we were in Cannes twenty four, wasn’t it, twenty four? Yeah. So, you know, just over eighteen months ago and literally over a beer at a bar in Cannes, we were just sort of chatting about the Cannes Lions Festival that year. And one thing we noticed was, you know, in particular, every second talk that year was about, guess what, AI and over beer, we were sort of thinking like, look, the industry is changing massively. Um, this is not just a little sort of change, it’s seismic what’s happening. And so if we were to use our skills and experience, what would we do that’s forward facing and going to pioneer, um, this new form of filmmaking and AI is obviously that. So that’s where the inception for eye candy was first born and then, you know, a whole range of checkpoints along the way between now and then allowed us to do what we’re doing. Yeah, I just adding to that was like in twenty twenty four when we were at the Cannes Lions, there was so much talk around AI avatars, efficiencies in AI, touching a little bit on AI film generation. Yeah, but it was kind of still laughable even back then. Like, you know, eighteen months ago, you know, Smith type stuff. Will Smith eating spaghetti, right. That’s that’s now the, the the universal indicator of like how far AI film generation has got to. Right. If you look at Will Smith eating spaghetti today, it’s like astronomical. The change that’s happened over the last eighteen months. But, um, you know, there was a poor spec ad in January after our conversation. We just kept them going. Um, and it came out, it came out, pushed back, came out like in around January, January this year, which it seems like eons ago.

Like, you know, like forever. Um, but when that came out, it was like, you know, That could have been shot from Wes Anderson, you know, like, you know, beautifully scripted voiceover over the top. The characters felt real. Like there was a few kind of bits, if you look at it now, like we felt been real, but it’s like, wow, they’re AI generated people. And those cars on the road, well, they look slick. Wow. That was like and it was at that point when Ken and I were like, all right, it’s actually officially ready to go. There was one more piece of the puzzle that we were kind of like, which is lip syncing. Like that was aha. Yeah, yeah, we were waiting for that to hit and we thought that would be wouldn’t be ready even this year. Yeah. It was May this year. Yeah. May this year Google Vo3 cracked and then crazy. That’s when you’ve seen like the real everything kind of hit the market. And we’ve been talking about it ever since. But it was kind of a good and bad thing. It means like there’s there’s a lot of bad things going to market with people, you know, who are utilizing AI in the wrong ways and bad ways. But, you know, what it means for us is that that was that was the last piece, which is a go to market strategy for broadcast quality, um, content that we can create with characters with, you know, big VFX. Um, anything that we want to do and create now is at our hands and crafted at the right level. It can be it can be a beautiful work. And I think we’ll look back on twenty five as the year where everything sort of clicked and locked into place. You know, pre twenty five was we were in sort of gimmick land. Yeah. Where it was like, oh that’s kind of cool. And but you know it’s got no commercial reality. And twenty five will be that year. That will in five ten years time look back on and go, that was it. That was the year where everything locked in. It’s interesting that like just before we get to that, just on the lip syncing part that you said, because I’ve seen some ones where you get the AI like and it sounds all great and stuff except like Crystal, like, I’ll be talking about something and then the AI will take over and it’ll be my voice or the AI’s voice switching over to the next character. It’s like, and it’s a guy and girl or whatever. The guy, the girl takes over and they’re both like mouthing, but it’s coming out. It’s weird when it’s not done right, and you just you notice these, you know, though the human eye notices any little imperfection, you know. And but now we’re at a point where the synthetic voices that we create with the synthetic characters that we create is seamless. Wow. You know, so you can control the voice, you know, what sort of, you know, dialect, language. You know, how you know the all the the sound of the voice and it will perfectly match to that character. And so the ability to be able to do that was what made this year. And that was that last piece of the puzzle that we needed to drop into place. And that was that moment. I mean, even even editing videos myself. Like, I know if there’s this, this slight even like a oh point zero zero one of a millisecond off in a voice it like, froze the entire experience off. It’s amazing just that, that minutiae of detail. And sometimes you don’t know what it is. And your brain, it does fix it. Exactly. But also that. And then that comes down. There are still, you know, AI is the film generation is not perfect on the first run, right? And that’s where the level of craft comes through, where Kent and I are with our experience in, you know, production and creativity and, you know, over the past twenty plus years and agency and filmmaking space know the nth degree of when to stop crafting. And there’s so many people who are like, oh, that’s funny. Get it out to market. And they’re like, oh, it’s got six fingers and it’s kind of the sinks off or something. Yeah. And it’s like and then people go, oh, AI is just not up to scratch. Well, it is if it’s in the right hands and people who will who will know when to stop crafting. Everyone can have a hammer, but only a carpenter can really properly make something truly beautiful. And like you see that when? Remember when it was like Midjourney and like the early image generation. Some people that like anyone could create something. But the true, true craftsmen were the ones that knew exactly lighting effects and this type of camera and this type of lens. And I’m like, whoa, like you really saw a big difference. Yeah. And that’s important. It’s shifting what creativity also means. And I really want to dive into that. Um, very shortly. Yeah, I want to you guys have had some both of you have had some incredible leadership roles, as we’ve touched on before. From creative director at Brand Agency Perth, executive creative director at Dentsu um, chief creative officer at General store. Talking about yourself here, Marcus. Um, with that transition through these leadership roles in a very creative space where traditionally I wouldn’t say tech hasn’t touched it, but like that, that hasn’t taken over that creativity element too much.

How have you seen that evolution and transition from pre to post AI, and what it’s meant to a lot of people who are in that sort of space that you’ve been sitting in? Yeah, I mean, it’s it’s not too much of a transition to be honest. Like the process that I mean, look, we we do work for brands, agencies, production companies. Um, but if we’re to work to say on brands, um, it is exactly the same process. And to be honest, the efficiencies come in the AI film production. But when it comes to strategy and creative is exactly the same process. Right. We’re going. You know, our first big project out of, um, Paris, um, got greenlit in our first month, and and it was, you know, second week. Was it? Yeah, yeah. Second week. Yeah, yeah. And do it what? It was like bang. We’re on. Um, and, you know, very complicated model that, you know, it’s a very, you know, famous in the e-commerce world, um, not a famous brand. And, um, you know, to, you know, and in terms of a household name, because it sits in the back end of big companies like Macy’s and Best Buy and whatever in the States. But, um, trying to explain their e-commerce model in a, to simplify it, we had to really break down the strategy and go through rounds of. Right, we know you want to say this, but we need to say one thing properly and, you know, go through the whole strategy around it and then go into creativity, like exactly what I’ve done at every other agency where, you know, have a process called Idea labs, where we kind of we’ll break down, you know, we’ll stress test the strategy in five different directions and break that down. And like, you have five different concepts. Um, you know, going from our savers to the wildest and, like, we’ll probably pick somewhere in between, um, and then we’ll go, cool. Let’s go. Picture. Um, go into full script, write the scripts. You know, I’ll be a part of that journey. Um, and, and Kent and I will both be like, you know, we both play, you know, you know, uh, like, roles together. Like, we’re both kind of creative, both production. So we’re both a lot of crossover. Yeah, a lot of crossover. So. And then we’ll pull in, um, you know, the freelance help that we require at certain times as well through that process. So that’s normal right. And that’s to be honest, in terms of agency land, nothing has changed. It’s only when you then get into production and most of the the start of the pre-production exactly the same too. Well, I mean, even you can talk about that. Yeah, even even production is like so similar. And so I guess, you know, this new world that we’re creating and pioneering, a lot of people are like, oh, you know, AI, how does AI film production work? And once we get into production, everyone’s like, oh wow, it’s really familiar. And you know, so we’ve still got the same process. Like, you know, what does our cast look like? You know, the AI characters, what are the locations look like. But their AI locations, you know, what does the storyboards look like. So there’s all these various stories. Absolutely. So we’ll do a pre-production meeting, which, you know, everyone knows what a pre-production meeting is. So everyone has this expectation. And when we go into pre-production meeting, they’re like, oh wow, this is this is really familiar. And instead of like, we’ll see on set tomorrow morning at seven a m for the shoot, we’re now going to go and create the shots. And then we go into offline sound mix grade and all of that. So it’s really, really familiar and makes everyone feel super comfortable because you say so. So you’ve been through, um, you were executive producer Nakatomi, um, the director at interactive at at Traffic Air and head of production at tech and innovation at Huawei as well. Yeah. So dealing with a lot of these people who are going through the production phases, as you mentioned. It’s like the people who are checking out the sites, the people who are looking at the who are going to be the people present and what they look like and what they dress. You just mentioned there, around that there, you’re now utilizing AI tools to do that. So has there been an impact on people who aren’t understanding of how to use these tools to be able to do that? Roles like what’s happened to the person who used to go do all the site checks and the. Yeah, look, I think we’re going through this evolution right now. Yeah. Um, the industry is changing. There’s no question about it. Um, and I think what we’re doing is leading, leading the way. Um, so there is change, but I guess, you know, if we look back, you know, throughout our career, there’s been a whole range of different checkpoints, you know, where, you know, going from film to digital. You know, I remember, you know, being on set, you know, you know, producer days, uh, you know, on a traditional shoot and calling, you know, the lab and going, you know, hold the bath. I’m coming over with the film stock like it’s. No, it’s not ready, guys. Get it in there. I’m gonna feed the feed. The feed. I need a one light, you know, for the morning, you know? So those days change, and we’re going through another big change now. I mean, the change we’re going through now is seismic. I’ve actually personally never seen it of this scale. And so quickly. Right. So quickly. Like, you know, we’re we’re right on the edge of, you know, the level of change happening. We’re finding it hard to keep up. So it’s it’s moving that fast. Like something will come out and then a week later it’s replaced with something new. And so we’re constantly evolving with the change happening. But the roster of directors that we’ve signed, um, that are on our books, you know, we’ve got fifteen signed globally from all over the world. So, you know, New York, LA, Stockholm, Tokyo, Barcelona, Paris, Morocco, Panama, the list goes on. They are the best of the best globally. So it took Marcus and I nine, nine months to a year to find them.

Signed them. Um, the sign now exclusively to us here in APAC, which is amazing. And so it allows us, you know, and they’ve all got their own specialties, again, like a traditional production company. Um, you know, someone might specialize in comedy or drama or sci fi or whatever. And so a script will come in. Marcus and I will read it and we’ll look at it and kind of go, that’s a perfect fit for that person, and then engage them on the project and off we go. Yeah. What’s what’s exciting about using the talent from around the world as well? Traditionally in a traditional sense, like, you know, if in Australia the budgets aren’t as big and it’s like you’d have to be a seismic kind of budget to go, we need to get this person from LA or Paris or whatever, to fly them over and put them up in a fancy hotel for three weeks. And you know, all that don’t need any more because they do their work from home. Um, you know, all the work comes on us because we start at like six thirty a m and finish at eleven p m because we’re kind of us in the morning, Europe at night. Australia in the middle. Um, and dealing with the meetings. But from a client’s point of view, they just see an edit at nine o’clock am every morning. Right. And, um, you know, here’s where it’s at, here’s where it’s at, here’s where. And so they need to go and set its time efficiencies. We get to use the best in the world without any extra cost of using someone in Australia as well. Uh, which is amazing, right? So we can use the very best talent in the world, not just in Australia. Um, which is. That’s super exciting. That’s super exciting. I just want to touch as well. On on your question about the change as well. Um, and I feel like, yes, there’s some change, but and on a day to day level, um, that might be a little unsettling, but take a bigger picture view. This industry needs a change, you know, like it’s it’s slowly going downhill. Budgets keep coming down and down and down. They’re not going up. Right. And you know, when we first started in, in in advertising twenty plus years ago. Um, you know, I was twenty plus. Um, it’s a scary number, right? I literally just turned forty the couple of days ago, so I’m a bit younger than you guys, but it’s like just to say twenty years now, it’s. I’m almost forty. Yeah. There you go. I’m older than you. Oh, God. I’m thirty. Yeah, yeah. I’ll tell. I’ll give you all the tips of what happens as soon as it crosses your knees fall apart. Ankles. Um, no. But look, um, you know, budgets keep coming down and down, and it’s like when we first started, you know, the budgets, you know, you wouldn’t get out of bed for less than twenty grand for it to to shoot something. Right now, the budgets come in. They’re like, what can you do with a hundred grand? You know, like, yeah to do like a big brands. But it’s like you have to say no or you, you go to a production company and you end up using like the kid that got on the roster that’s just out of film school. And then then you end up half directing the spot yourself and then all the onus comes back on you as the creative director to kind of like all the things that go wrong. It’s like the agency’s fault, right? Like, and, um, what the exciting thing is now is like, we we can create what we call we make impossible ideas possible. That’s our whole ethos. And the main crux of that is that, like high quality expectations have remained a constant. Like clients will not budge on quality that needs to stay the same, if not better. Like, you know that people expect the very best. As films get better, they want to see their advertising the same as what they see on screen. But budgets keep coming down and down, and there’s a number of reasons for that. You know, higher interest rates, uh, the spread of, um, budgets across not just advertising and to search digital, kind of all the different spaces that budget needs, for whatever reasons that it’s now come down as like for this production, you have X amount and it’s so much less than what it used before. So in between those high quality expectations and decreasing budgets, ideas are becoming more and more impossible to make. And that’s where we sit is now, because the obvious cost savings and time savings, which are, you know, like not minor like that, we can actually turn like what would be a regular, um, you know, sometimes mundane script or, you know, you know, content kind of script into a big level, um, you know, super Super Bowl level production, you know, you know, just have to have someone running down the street on in an in urban Sydney. Well, let’s have them running across the Himalayas and let’s have ten people doing it with him because the the talent’s free and there’s no rollover fees. And, um, you know, we don’t have to wait for weather holds because it’s sunny every day or it’s you want it raining instead. Like, you know, like there’s amazing things you can do with to create impossible ideas, which would have been formerly impossible. It’s interesting because a lot of people think of like initially the things that I can do within a business, like I’m thinking from a corporate setting. But just like any kind of use case is, it’s like, well, how do we get it to automate and make easier and more efficient, like the existing kind of workflows? That’s great. But I’ve seen and try and drive this myself. It’s like, that’s great, but it’s still a race to zero because lowering costs and the pressure that you were describing there in your industry, but it’s where this new technology becomes something that you can actually create new things that you would never have thought about before. And we were just discussing this, you know, earlier in the prep, um, there’s all that creativity that only comes from having experts that go, actually, now that I understand this tool, experts that understand both sides, it’s their industry really well, as you guys clearly do. But then it’s what the tech does and coming up with something new, not just doing the same old thing that we’ve been doing before, but like, what else can we do? What does that kind of look like from a, you know, boundary breaking perspective for you guys? Well, I think like a good answer to that is, um, um, mantra is let’s make, you know, we make the impossible. Yep. And so we’ve all got, you know, bottom drawers with full of ideas, you know, where ideas that for a million reasons could never happen. Um, and so when we, when we started icandy, you know, living to that mantra, let’s make the impossible. We looked in our bottom drawers and there was an idea, you know, that I had in mind from probably five or six years ago. And I remember pitching it, you know, at the agency I was at at the time and getting told, look, for a million reasons, it can’t happen. And you know what?

Those reasons at the time were one hundred percent valid. But with what we’re doing and we can literally do anything, we pulled it out. We made it. And it’s a United Nations, uh, film, which I don’t know if you can play during. That’ll be what I’ll do is I’ll put a link somewhere around here, put a link, just click that. Yeah. Um, but yeah, check it out. Definitely check it out. It’s very good. It’s a, it’s it’s been a career highlight moment bringing that film to life. It really has because it’s an idea that would have stayed in the bottom drawer and never seen the light of day, and bringing it out and telling that story and telling the story to the world. It helps reframe climate change, because climate change is a headline. And I think it’s kind of just walked over. Yeah. And to be able to tell that story and get it out there and articulate climate change in a different way. So it’s visual. And also using AI data to dictate what the outcome could look like. So it’s all because you gathered information actually from from climate sources and utilize that data to predict what would happen and then utilize real data engine to create the imagery strategically pulled from like number of different resources to use actual real data of what’s, you know, rising sea levels will look like in different countries across the world, specifically to those countries. You know, we’re we could then and, you know, give Kent full credit for being the film director on this too. He’s the only one who’s actually up to standard that we feel in Australia who can get to the level of craft that we want to get to, which is why we use a lot of people across the world. Um, and we’re looking for more and we’re talking to more. There are there there’s some starting to pop up now, but the work that, um, you know, that that, that Kent did in supporting to accurately demonstrating what that rising sea level looks like in Tokyo, in Mumbai, you know, New York, um, you know, Amsterdam, um, underneath, you know, bikes submerged and etc. like, um, it really puts it from what was formerly like just a graph which feels like not human and whatever into something real with emotion. And, you know, like I get like Kent talk about it, but we, we we’ve got an amazing track, um, Mad World over the top, which is an amazing moment. We we yeah, yeah, we we we threw that track down onto the timeline. And when we watched it, we were like, oh my God, that’s the song. Yeah. And so we, we, you know, had had one of the early, um, off lines and literally sent it over to Gary Jules, um, and his record label and thinking, honestly, we’d probably never hear back. Thirty six hours later, he came back saying, love the project I’m in and gifted us the song. So are you in? It’s just like, I mean, I still get yeah, I got such a cool moment to be able to go, oh, wow. You know, we’re using AI for good to tell a story that’s going to change, hopefully create change. And, you know, having Gary Jules give us his song to use for the project was it was a really cool moment. It was also a massive gamer myself. And uh, there was a game that came out in oh eight going back to Xbox two, the three sixty with Gears of War, and it was a kind of an under the radar game, but they also used the the Mad World song and that literally that song on the trailer, like just boosted the feel. It got the feels. It’s amazing how much a tune can impact, like the visuals and the emotion of a game. Yeah, it’s a lovely demonstration as well of like a film generation with a real world track, you know, like, it doesn’t all have to be AI, like the components that can be used in different ways, you know, from actually, you know, we often still do proper, you know, on a, on a finished spot. We’ll do a sound mix, proper sound mix across spots because we find that that fine tuning, we want to be in the booth and be kind of like, I mean, we’re just looking at every little layer of craft, you know, the grade, the color, you know, like we’ll go to a color or, you know, the sound mix and just just everything, like everything that goes out the door from an eye candy point of view has to live up to the brand that we’re building and be world class. And it’s just tech at the end of the day. Like we spoke a little bit about it before, um, but you know, we’re using Adobe like or DaVinci and other kind of tools and stuff. And it’s got so the definition of like AI. Sure. The world now knows AI, but that’s generative AI, which is the neural networks and all that tech behind that. But there’s all these other AI that’s in everyday products that we use. We don’t care about AI. Then in blockchain, the space that I’ve come from in the past or still still working, they say that the success is going to be when people aren’t talking about blockchain anymore.

It’s just like they’re just they’re using it. It’s payment rails, it’s getting instantaneous payments, and escrow is very cheap and all that kind of stuff. But it’s just finance tech. At the end of the day, I think that success will be for us. Like, yeah, it’s still early. It’s AI very centric, but it’s tech. It’s the difference between product and feature. Like it’s like you’re utilizing it in a way that it isn’t a product. You’re using learning, utilizing in a way that it is a feature of the craft that you guys. It’s a tool. It’s a tool. It’s a tool at the end of the day. And I often think in it’s probably mid next year, you know, so it’s not far off where we’ll actually stop talking about AI like we are talking about it, you know, today. Yeah. So it’d just be a thing and it would just be a thing. It’s almost like, you know, you don’t talk about the camera that you’re using. It’s just it’s a tool. Yeah. People do sometimes though. Sometimes. So but for us is, you know, AI is literally just a tool. too. And, you know, we often get asked the question, which one do you use? You know, like it’s just this one magic silver bullet. We use all of them, you know, and it’s it’s not about. Oh well that one, that one, that one. It’s like, what’s the right tool to tell the best version of that story? And it might be for that one, you know, use that, that, that. But actually for this story, it’s this, this, this. You’re a chef. You’re looking at the right ingredients to create the masterpieces. Right? Looking at the industry broadly, there’s a lot of positive and negative discussions around just the creative element that brings to all of this. Um, you know, you got the Paul McCartney’s Joseph Gordon-levitt’s of the world who are like, you know, AI is a great thing. Um, but it shouldn’t creative people off. Or as long as AI company can copy all of our content into their models, um, at no cost and and spit out quasi new content for close to no cost. There’s no logical business case for for paying human creators anymore. Um, with the stuff that you’re doing, obviously there’s a lot of benefit around that creative, creative element that it does bring and that that innovative way that’s changing what creativity means. How are you seeing, I guess, what’s your perspective on what it’s doing to the creative space, particularly where AI generation is, while it is building on the creative ideas that you may have, it is still machine learning off of other people’s content. So what’s your what’s your perspective on on that and what it’s doing. Yeah. Look I that’s there’s two parts to that. Um you know firstly like you know it’s not just built off people’s art. It’s it’s, you know, AI is built off every piece of content that the world has uploaded to the internet for the last forty years. Yeah, billions of data points, billions of data points. Yeah. Um, and yeah, look, it’s whatever people uploaded. It’s kind of utilizing that in different ways and forming different ways of doing things. But in terms of creativity, a lot of people, you know, obviously fear change, right? And it’s kind of like there is a bit of a monumental shift in industries that are happening. So it’s very easy to go paint AI with one brush and go, it’s all bad or it’s all too much or whatever, but everything that we do is human creativity powered by AI efficiency. We we still need, you know, either working with brands, we come up with the ideas ourselves or with agencies, bring us a killer script and don’t quite have the budget, and we can create it right. And we can create it on more moderate budgets. We still need human ideas like, you cannot go into ChatGPT and go give me an award winning, Cannes line winning film script on on mobile phones for Telstra press go. It doesn’t happen like you. You need to sit there in a room, laptop, clothes and think about what? What that I, you know, based off the strategy. What that will, um, idea will, you know, will come up with and go back and forth and ideate and get with clients and brainstorm. Yep. Same process. And once you get to a film generation. So in terms of like creating new content, it’s like, yeah, there’s a lot of slop out there that borrows kind of trends and and replicates kind of, you know, stunts, Mamie kind of things. But like in terms of, like real true stories that still comes from the heart. It comes from humans. And in fact, we don’t see ourselves as an AI company. We see ourselves as a story company. Right? Like it’s we create great stories, that’s what. And it’s a similar ethos to, you know, like we we actually came to stumble across the other day like a great, um, you know, news clipping from, from Steve Jobs when he was CEO of Pixar many years ago. Like, you know, he was CEO of Apple and then kind of left and then became CEO Pixar and then Apple again after. But when he was here, he transformed that company from a technology company and doing different things. And a company, if you will, to, you know, a world class story company for animation. And you can see that through this Toy Story franchise that he was part of starting. And when it got to Toy Story three, that was nominated in the Academy Awards for Best Picture, not Best Animation and Best Craft or Best Best Picture amongst the best films in the world. It was nominated in the top four films of the world that year. So that just goes to show that they had this ethos of story, story, story, and they got to the very world’s best work, and that will continue. And that’s what we see ourselves as is like creating amazing stories, um, through, you know, what the scripts that agencies bring us or the, you know, the stories that we create ourselves and or how we can elevate any idea and then use AI, the efficiencies of AI to bring that to life, um, and bring more, more ideas to life than ever before, which is exciting thing. You guys know as well, like which is the because you know your craft before all of the new techs come in, you actually, you know well for this particular process and when you understand the model from from that side, like those two things, like Steve understood art and he understood tech obviously. Yeah. You know, he didn’t build all the stuff was did all of that. And now there’s people that will argue that. But like because he had that general knowledge of like both sides, he was able to merge that together in a way to create beautiful things. But same thing here. Like unless you actually knew your art form beforehand, you can’t just use the tech. A tech person coming in will not do as well as just, you know, someone with the combined experience. So I think it’s really key to to show people this is not just humans in the loop. This is experts totally expertise. I see what you did there. We look we have um, we have this, you know, analogy that we, we use in our trades deck where, you know, it’s an image of a F1 fighter jet with a set of keys on the table And the reason for that is like in theory, you know, AI is available to anyone and everyone. Yep. Um, but in the wrong hands. People that don’t understand filmmaking don’t understand craft, don’t understand storytelling. All the things we do in our roster do, um, you’re just going to create more AI slot. So, you know, with the analogy, it’s like in theory I could hand the keys to, you know, and if I’m fighter jet and say take jump and take it for a spin and know how you’re going to go, I know how I would go crash and burn. It’s the same thing with AI in the wrong hands. You’re just adding to more AI slop that’s out there in the market. And for us, you know, going back to back to your question, Chris, you know, a second ago, um, we are, you know, intrinsically, we we are a top tier AI creative film production company. That’s what we are. And so for us, it’s all about creating original content, you know, stories that haven’t been told before, stories that, you know, make the audience feel something, uh, connect, X strike an emotion. And, you know, obviously, you know, um, add to the, you know, the, the brand message that we’re trying to sell. But ultimately, if we can make the audience feel something and that United Nations is a really good example of that, because it does, it hits you, it hits you right there and it makes you stop and think. And the beautiful thing about that and all the work we’re doing, no one really thinks of, oh, that’s an AI production. Like if we if any of any audience goes, oh, that’s a really nice AI, you know, film. We’ve failed. We’ve failed doing our job. It’s about creating films and stories that just are out there. And AI is in the back room. That’s allowed us to generate these stories and get them out in market, I love it. There’s a few things that I really like, so there’s a lot. One of the first things is you touched on was the AI is obviously trained on billions of touch points to do things. I mean, so are people. So when someone says AI is copying the creative elements of everyone else, it’s like you were trained on those elements. When you create something, whether you’re doing a painting, you were inspired by a creative, by some sort of painter. You didn’t do it from scratch. That’s right. Um, there’s there’s also an element that I, that I touch on a lot when I talk about this myself from the creative space is that you’re partnering with AI. It’s not replacing you. You are utilizing as a tool, as you guys talk about, which means it’s elevating the work that you’re doing, not replacing the work that you’re doing. Um, if, uh, on the other side of that is that if it is something new that is outside of that sort of copy paste world of the AI can’t yet do, we will still pick it up and do it ourselves like we will do things. Without AI. We can still be creative without AI. And so if you think that there is a challenge to that, go and do the thing without AI and have fun with that and utilize it. Um, something you hinted at, which I also liked, was the difference between and you said it as well with the slop, the difference between content creating content and creative as content. That’s right. There’s a big difference between the two, right? You are as a creative going in. You’re doing something. You’re creating. You’re building a human emotion into something to make people feel. You’re not just plugging in a keyword and pushing it out there. It’s not like it’s a shitty thing. I think that come and look, that’s that’s where it utilizes can to my experience. Right. Um, you know, to replicate the model that we’ve got, like, you would need to be have two people that have like a love of technology and an understanding and love of film craft, um, and the experience of twenty plus years, like, in the commercial and marketing space, putting all that together on a daily basis within tight formats. Right. You know, and so that’s where Ken and I come in, like using it, you know, either whether it’s us creating and and producing and, you know, a lot of people who are doing the kind of thing that we’re doing are A sometimes one man bands or two man bands or whatever, but we’re us plus utilizing the best of the world. So and you know, knowing the level of craft to get to like so much going to the F-1 fighter jet analogy, people are flying F-1 fighter jets into the wall because, because, because they’re there. They don’t know that level of craft. They’ll get things out to the world after their first, um, edit, you know, and go, right, okay, let’s get it out. And it’s like, got six fingers and there’s crazy things happening in the sinks off and whatever. And it’s like, yeah, but there’s a bit of an idea there. Well, that’s not craft. Yeah. It’s like once you, we know when to stop crafting. And if our AI film directors, who all have world class experience, they know when to stop. And if we don’t feel it was up to scratch, we say go again. Like we need to keep going and to the point we’re building a brand. And yeah, we’ve got to hit that level of quality on on all of our projects, you know, because exactly. That’s, that’s the work we’re putting out in the in market. And it’s interesting like we’ll get, you know, a lot of, um, clients approach us with a project and say, look, here it is. Here’s a script.

You know, we need to get it done in a week. And it’s like you’re shading to the line. It’s not what we’re about. It’s just not the work we do. Yeah, like the work. While it’s a significant obviously, um, budget saving with, you know, working in AI and time saving, um, it’s just not the work we do. You know, we, we want to give ourselves and our team the right amount of time to craft the project. So the films go out and they’re on brand with eye candy, and I love that. It’s the other thing is you’re you’re actually elevating and challenging a space, an industry that probably needs that challenge in the creative space right now. You know, we talk about AI slot, but there’s also a lot of cinema slot and like repeating the same content, developing movies that have already been developed or I mean, even in the video game industry, the same thing is happening. It’s just copy paste stuff. So this has been an opportunity for people to really be pushed in the creative space to do things that they haven’t been able to do before. As you touched on, but also haven’t done because they’ve been too lazy. And it’s like, right now we can clearly see that you’re copying pasting. You’ve got to really step up your game. And because the expectation the bar is lowered up as high now. So you need to stand out. You’ve got to properly be creative. We all you know, we often say we all need to retrain our brain. Yeah. And what I mean by that is, you know, for our entire careers, we’ve kind of gone down one path of, you know, creating content. And it’s worked beautifully. But now we’ve got this completely other path, you know, that is a huge unlock for creativity and ideas and can take an idea to another level that we just couldn’t go to before. And so that’s really exciting. So everyone’s kind of, you know, the whole industry’s got to kind of go kink. You know, we can do things differently and rethink how we can approach creating films and content. It’s a step up of a level, right. Like if if the rising game changer, it is a game changer. And, um, there’s a saying in I worked in finance for a while and there’s this saying around like investments, like the rising tide lifts all boats. And when things turn bad, like, you really see who’s out there, like properly paddling or whatnot. But, um, I in the initial sense, like everyone got access to it and all the, all the tools and stuff. Um, and everyone said, oh, look, I can create this, I can create that. But after a while you’re like, oh, hang on a second. The ones that really stand out are the ones that know their craft the artist, the the master chefs, so to speak, and, and actually are able to use it within a proper professional kind of workflow. I think that’s really key. Well, it’s actually a point that I wanted to land as well about. Our our film directors is like, they’re not. When we say film directors, you’re probably picturing an eighteen year old kid in their bedroom, kind of who knows the tech who it’s actually quite the opposite. Quite often they’re people in their forties or even fifty, like very experienced film directors, like film directors, traditional film directors or creative directors or colorists or editors or someone who knows everything, that’s the perfect package. And so when we interview and talk and test the best film directors around the world, we often get into beyond what you’ve done. What’s your experience? Because we want to know that they understand traditional craft. It’s almost like learning the AI tools is the easy part. Yeah, you know what I mean? Like that’s when people go, yeah, I know all the tools and I know Google is like, yeah, what what experience have you had in filmmaking? Because we need to they need to have that knowledge first. So all our AI film directors across the planet have at least ten to twenty years experience in, in film production and commercial, um, you know, sense and film, the immense importance of process. Right? Yeah, exactly. And then I’ve spent the last six to eighteen months learning the tools. Yeah, right. That’s the that’s the small part. But we want people with all that experience and that’s where you get the best work, because that’s vital having that experience that they can bring over. And, you know, we almost use the analogy in a sort of crossing, crossing over and jumping to the other side, which obviously we’ve done and haven’t looked back for a second, but having that experience that they can bring with them when they sort of do cross over and, you know, step into this AI world of filmmaking is just vital because, you know, they’ll understand the difference between holding on that shot for an extra two frames to land that comedic moment or not. And you can’t teach so subtle. Yeah, it’s so subtle and you can’t teach it. You’ve either got it and you’ve got it because you’ve accrued it and your career with your skills and experience, or you don’t have it, you know. So yeah, it’s an interesting point because like right now, just wider industry, the biggest worry right now is like, oh, if AI is going to do all the jobs that a paralegal does or like a junior or an internal, like someone just out of uni, what’s going to happen? How are they going to get experience? But here’s the thing. It’s like you, they those jobs will be different, like what a junior does in a job because of these new tools. This we still need juniors because they have to get experience. But it’s going to be very, very different. We’re just thinking of it like AI is automated that as if like or AI, you know, technology is automated farming. Oh no, we don’t have jobs. We’re not farmers anymore. We evolved. Right? We created new things. And I feel like it’s going to be the same. Um, and so people will still have to get that experience in using the new tools that are out there now. Because more coffee orders. More more coffee orders, obviously still a thing, but, um, yeah, I just feel like it’s it’s so true. Not this Chicken Little. The sky is completely falling. There’s still a need for the experience, which you guys clearly show. We spoke about this, uh, when we caught up and, um, an interesting, really interesting statistics. And you obviously did a lot of research into this and throughout the entire world. One of the biggest things that people talk about when it comes to AI is the impact on the environment. You’ve done this amazing video with the, um, Mad World, and it touches on the impact on the environment and what we’re seeing in the future. Go with with everything. Tell me what you’ve discovered in terms of the impact on the environment, of how you are now producing your content or your your, your cinema and your movies and your videos are like versus the old school way. Yeah. Traditional way. I can take this one. So I guess look, AI gets a bad rap does, you know, there’s the headline. You know, AI leaves a whopping carbon footprint. Um, everything leaves a carbon footprint. I was doing this podcast today is leaving a carbon footprint. So I think it’s really important to kind of just step right. Cameras off, guys, we need to. Yeah. No, but I think it’s it’s important to kind of step back. And we’ve actually done a lot of research on it because it is a question that comes up. And when you compare AI film production with against traditional film production, AI film production is far greener. And I’m talking ninety nine percent greener. Yeah. So traditional film production, the thirty second TVC, see, you know, lights, camera. Three phase power set builds. Travel. Ding ding ding ding ding. Creates, on average, a forty tons of CO2. I mean, like it’s huge. Yeah. Hey, I film production thirty second TVC creates fifty kilograms. Wow. So it’s ninety nine percent greener. And so you know these numbers forty times. What does that mean? Forty tons of CO2 equates to sixteen hot air balloons completely full. Yeah fifty kilograms is two percent of one hot air balloon. Probably just like a little balloon. Yeah. So, you know, like it’s kind of, you know, really burst that bubble of AI is about learning environment in when you compare apples to apples. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, a lot of the thing is it’s this is the discussion I have that people don’t realize. It’s it’s not necessarily the AI you individually using it. It’s the fact that it has been adopted by so many people, it’s the now the volume is usage when it comes. It’s the mass adoption, right. It’s the same thing that happened with blockchain, right? There’s became a massive adoption, something that was just the technology that became always on. That’s why the consumption was so high. Um, and when you have this volume of, of easy adoption of tech, unfortunately it’s going to have a CO2 impact. But there are areas where it will create opportunity to reduce those impacts, such as what you said in the production. It’s like, you know, it’s very easy again, to paint AI with one brush, you know, like it’s uh, there are different forms, it’s changing the industry. And, you know, like, yes, AI film production, sorry. AI in general uses a lot of, um, CO2 if you compare it to turning on a light switch. Right. Because of everyone in the world is using ChatGPT because it’s so useful. Right? So yeah, it’s using a lot. Um, but as Kent mentioned, if you take that away and you look at traditional food production compared to AI, film production is, you know, small team of people using it between a massive team traveling across the world. Lights on.

Like when you look at it from that perspective, you’re like, oh wow, it is actually so much greener. Yep, like ninety nine percent greener. Yeah. Which is wild when you think about it, one hundred percent. But then when you also step back and think about it, it’s like, well, yeah, of course it would be. Yeah, yeah. So when we talk to, you know, a lot of brands these days that are big B-corp certified, that is a huge tick. You know, AI film production in its favor over traditional film production. It was interesting, um, when we when we first started, you know, I think it was the first month we were chatting with the client, and that was one of the points that came up in conversation. And, you know, we explained almost like we just did then, and it completely reframed their perception. Um, and, you know, like those stats are based off, you know, white papers, you know, it’s it’s it’s factual. And so it reframed their position and allowed us to win the project. It’s lifting the hood underneath these, uh, lifting the hood on these things, because otherwise people would just hear the news and see the catastrophe and it just becomes hearsay. You know, it’s like, yeah, to prove that point, you know, the United Nations would not have endorsed our film. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. About the twenty thirty goals. Right. Unless we were greener than traditional, like, you know, they’ve done the numbers as well. So it’s, you know, in talking to the, you know, the president of the United Nations of Australia recently, they’re so excited about this film about going global and going into New York and, and you know, like potentially reaching the advocates across the world, you know, who want it. Yeah. So there’s a whole there’s a whole like, um, timeline now that we’re putting in place for that film just to really maximize its reach, which is. Yeah. Because they can they can see the, you know, it’s living by the ethos. I production is living by the ethos of supporting the twenty thirty sustainability goals because it’s actually using. It’s using AI in a positive way. So far so good for for the planet. So it gives them an asset that they’ve never had before. You know, in this film, you know, to be able to tell the story visually because it’s never been able to be it’s never been done before. It’s always been a headline or a a chart or a chart or a graph. And, you know, I think, you know, society just becomes blind to those things. It’s like, oh yeah, there’s another headline or another graph and it’s just. Yep. Uh, I can imagine so many scenarios where, um, you know, it’s gone from a world I come from, that data science kind of world where it’s like numbers in a spreadsheet. It’s like, what does it do? But then you turn it into graph and go, oh, cool. And I can interact with it and great. But this is like taking it to that next level, especially for things that really need it. So it’s that leveling up again because like you said, it’s not like you see these graphs, you see these charts, but it’s not impactful. Well now that coupled with the creativity coupled with hey, thank you Gary Jules for like letting this song be used like it. Really. That’s where it hits. Yeah. And then the next one will be taking it further. So I think, you know, we’ll just be on this continuous, um, impactful kind of like next step. So so that’s great. Yeah. Adding to that point, um, the thing I love about the UN film is it’s really set a high benchmark for our studio. And I love that. Yeah. Now everything needs to ladder up to that project. And that’s for our, you know, debut project, which is that that is our first project we put out in market. I love that it’s really set that high precedent and that high bar for us to live up to. Yeah, yeah. It’s amazing. And there’s and there’s so much more coming. Yeah. Six projects currently in production right now. Yeah. And they all range you know like comedy you know drama. There’s yeah sci fi projects. So yeah they’re all in production now and they’ll be coming out in the coming months. So yeah we can’t wait to get them out there because because eye candy is not just it’s not a prompting tool. It’s not like someone, any person can go in and start generating stuff like you are a production company essentially that’s utilizing it. Yeah. Tell me about the process that someone would go through engaging with you guys to, to produce something like, you know, the Mad World video that you guys did. Well, I mean, look, it’s easy to kind of think of us as we often describe ourselves as think of it as a top tier production company, but we don’t use any cameras. Yeah. That’s it. So, you know, um, you know, a client or an agency might have a script. They’ll come to us. We’ll obviously review it in detail. Um, Marcus and I will then sort of go, that person probably could be the perfect fit for that project. Share the script with them, see if they’re interested in the project. If they are, they’ll put forward a treatment. It’s again, as I was saying earlier, like it’s just all the same process and that’s familiar to everyone. Um, put forward a treatment, obviously a budget, get it signed off and off we go. And then off we go on that journey of, you know, what does the cast look like? The locations, storyboards, you know, all the way through to mastering. Once they see that process, it’s kind of like, okay, you’re exactly like traditional film production, but you’re more efficient, faster and more cost effective. Yeah. Okay. Where do I sign? So it’s kind of like a no brainer. What are the types of tools that are changing the things that you guys are doing? Well, we use all of them. You know, so there’s no as I say, there’s no silver bullet. You know, like, we we literally use all of them. And for us, they’re just tools, you know. So you know what’s what’s, you know, your favorite lens. You know, it’s it’s kind of like, you know, what’s the right tool for that project that’s going to allow us to tell that story. So we literally use all of them. There’s probably thirty of our favorites and there’s more. Um, and, you know, our entire roster scattered all over the globe, uh, you know, world class across all of them. So, you know, it’s funny, like, we actually never really talk about the tools. It’s kind of like, this is the project. This is what we’re going to do. This is the perfect director for that project. And I mean, yeah, it does come up in conversation, but but it’s not. Can we talk about the tools because I think people listening are going to be interested about the tools as well. Sure. Well, we use all of them. I mean, you know, and they’re going to be brands, you know, so the three Higgs field or runway or journey like that, then the um, sorry, nano banana, which is the, the, the funny name for Poryes at what Google’s got. You’ve got the banana on the shirt. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that’s cool. We love bananas. Yeah. So does my daughter. But yeah it’s it’s again it’s like you know what’s what’s right for the project. And you know there’s there’s a whole range from an audio eleven labs, you know, you know, that allows, allows us to do some crazy, amazing stuff. Yeah. As soon as incredible. Yeah. We can do all of our, all of our audio is done with sooner as well. So it’s yeah, it’s it’s and the thing is next week there’ll be a new tool. Exactly, exactly. And the week after that there’ll be another one, you know. So it’s it’s for us, you know, keeping up with the tools. Um, and also making sure our roster is, you know, up to speed on everything. Um, so we can always be using the latest to tell the best stories. Yeah, I was going to say, oh go ahead. But we’re also, you know, like we’re creative partners with Leonardo AI and Freepik. Freepik like so. Yeah. And we we’re very tight with the AI community and making sure we’re up to date with the, with the right tools and also the, you know, the creative festivals and etc.. Um, so we’re kind of really part of that, that unit. But it’s funny when you ask about tools, it’s like we hardly it’s almost like coming to a production company and say, tell me what cameras you use. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It’s that kind of or what lens. And we, we understand, we use it, but it’s kind of like it’s when it comes like it’s really a normal process until you get to the AI film production. Right. And which, you know, either you know, Kent and I are part of if it’s our own particular project like the UN and we’re and it’s just us kind of working on the different takes and the edit and kind of like, you know, going the extra mile and what tools we use to kind of get to that level. But when we’re working on other projects, it’s exactly the same. Like, you know, either we are a creative and production company, right? Like, so we’re a bit of both in one, but we’re mainly a production company and with a creative resource, I guess you’d say. So agencies might bring us that killer script and, and we’ll suggest ways that we can elevate that script from a creative standpoint, knowing the abilities of AI and the different platforms and coming back to the retrain your brain, retraining your brain, like, or it’s like we start from scratch with a brand and go through strategy, creative, etc. until we get to the AI component. And then it’s either over to our AI film directors across the world using their different platforms and our partners and whatnot. Or we can it might be, um, doing the work himself. Yeah. Um, but yeah, that’s why it’s kind of like talking about the tools. We know about the tools, but it’s almost like a production company knowing which what, what cameras are available and using the red camera using the, you know, whatever. Yeah. I was just going to say, like, I think it’s, um, it’s it’s the, you know, it’s right in front of your face, kind of like moment kind of thing because you guys as like creative directors and leading creative as part of the work that you do in this production company, I think it’s not just in your industry. I think given what the changes going on right now, this just hit me that even ordinary companies, if they’re going to adopt AI, they have to think about it as a creative process because it is not just about the workflows and making things efficient, but how do you create new things in your space in healthcare, finance, etc.? Right. And it’s almost like if you’re going to do that, you need a production company either outside or a production or, you know, creative and production company on the inside. But it’s that creativity with AI that’s really going to break things down because like as you speak, it’s like there’s so many lessons there for founders. I think if they’re like, well, how do I use this in my space? Like, you know, think about it from the creative process that you guys go through. I just thought that that was like quite profound. I it’s actually funny, like Likewise, when we speak to a lot of agencies for like, you know, obviously we work with brands and agencies and production companies, but when we speak to agencies, um, a lot of the big ones, like they have an AI guy and that’s their, that’s their, their, their box ticked, you know, like they’re really an AI guy who kind of understands what’s happening in the space production or whatever. Or they might have an AI editor as part of the creative department. Right. And they treat it like almost like the in-house editor. You know, the in-house editor is like usually the person who does like the, um, you know, the case studies for award entries and whatever, but you wouldn’t use that at your in-house editor to do your latest big brand spot for X brand. You know, like, you wouldn’t you wouldn’t do that. You’d use a production company. Right. And so it’s like retraining the brain of, of agencies to go, if you’re going to do a big spot and you want a big production, do you do that with your in-house editor or do you do it with a production company? And we are that production company in the AR space, right? And it’s kind of like trying to get people to understand that if you want to get to that level of creativity, use someone that understands the AI world, the production world, the creative world who can elevate your script into a space that you, you know, that can give that idea that extra twenty, thirty, forty percent that you want. We’ll take take an idea that would be here to a Super Bowl level for sure. I think it talks to a lot of the problem with AI in the industry at the moment, in generally speaking, is like people just implementing a strategy that is just doesn’t fit the way that, you know, the business is working or the industry is working or whatever it is that they’re doing. By plugging in this one person, here’s the AI guy. It doesn’t solve the fundamental problem or introduce a solution to like the strategy that needs to be resolved across the business. I think it gives a nod to the shareholders. Exactly. And the higher stakeholders that they’ve got AI tech. Exactly. And it’s like it’s not really solving a problem, but it’s a placeholder to go. We’re thinking about AI. Yeah, but they’re not really doing anything. And it’s kind of when that’s when we speak to a lot of agencies and brands, they’re kind of like we’re actually executing properly in AI. We feel comfortable with people that know what the hell they’re doing. Exactly. Yeah. And have that level of craft and creativity on top of that. They’re not just tech guys, they’re creative guys and production guys as well. Yeah. And it talks to that human in the loop, which is what against your whole business is pretty much a model about all the expert in the loop is the is the term that we like to use now. And that expert in the loop is is essentially it should be anyone you use utilizing these tools. It’s if you’re going to introduce AI don’t just put a person in there. It’s either train your whole team up or train the business up. Or like you said, introduce like a third party, a company, an agency who is integrated with AI, who knows how to use it, who can then elevate the rest of the business. We often find like, you know, we getting pretty much nearly every agency in town, reaching out, wanting to meet with us. And once we go in and sort of run through our creds deck with them, you can almost hear a, you know, sigh of relief in the room. That’s kind of, you know, because you’re our allies. Okay? Right. Yeah. Well, it’s like we we’re there to help them, um, tell stories that they couldn’t tell because of a whole range of different reasons that they can now tell. And, you know, going back to what Marcus was saying, you know, we’ve got decreasing budgets, increased expectations, and those two worlds don’t normally ever meet. Whereas possible what we can do is, you know, I can you can bring those two worlds together. And when we explain that and show the work that we’re doing and talk about our roster of directors, you can literally, as I said, almost hit a, you know, a sigh of relief that you guys are as much a partner to them as, as I, as a partner to the stuff that it’s like, we’re not, you know, because we’re not the AI people taking away their creativity. We want human creativity exactly by our by efficiency. So and we can help with those decrease that decreasing budgets. We’ve been in the industry. We’ve seen over the last five, ten years. We’ve been part of the pain of seeing those budgets come down.

We have a solution. It’s almost like, you know, saying like the industry needs a solution to the problem. You know, like of that change. The industry needs change. Like it’s almost like, oh, you’re here to kind of save us in a way, you know, like, you know, we there is a way that we can get things done cheaper and faster at a at a high quality level. I think it’s interesting because like in the blockchain space, where and again, I’ll go back to that because it is a place that it’s AI’s always been around. We’ve always had data science and all these like kind of things. Machine learning neural nets were even around well before it all became popular. But just going back to it, like blockchain is face to critiques, it’s face, the challenges. And sure, it’s still going through its thing with regulation and all that kind of stuff. But in terms of like relating it back to, to this, like the, the things that, um, AI uh has has is really showing with what you guys have got is that it’s not it’s not out to get you like it’s out to, um, it’s there as a tool. And if you get to know it, it’s. Yeah. Yeah, if you get to know it, you’ll be less likely to be overcome by it. And in the blockchain space, that’s why we were arguing that we need to work with the banks, the central banks and and doing things in that traditional space, because a lot of the crypto space is all about anti-establishment and don’t do things a different way, go away from the banks, do this. And it’s like, no, but we need to understand what that side is doing to really, you know, bring to light the capabilities. And I think with AI, what you’re saying that we need to you guys are actually using it because unless creatives actually use it, then it’s going to overwhelm, right? So I think it’s great that you guys are doing that. We’ve seen that we’ve experienced the real world problem of decreasing budgets like the last two or three agencies especially, is like, whoa, this has gone from like it’s getting harder to like it’s becoming impossible. Which is why we make the impossible. That’s the whole ethos, is those impossible ideas can now be made on that as we, uh, come to a come to a close, like, where are we going? Where are you headed? Like, what’s the next step in this, this element in terms of where the tech is currently? I mean, obviously one of the biggest ticks in the box was the, um, having that voice alignment. Um, obviously things are going to continue to evolve. So what’s where do we see that next evolution in this space? It’s a good question. I mean, look, for the first point, first time in my career, I’ve always normally then able to sort of see, you know, five years ahead. It is moving so fast. So it’s really hard to kind of the questions for next month or next week. It is almost like that, you know, to be able to go, oh, in five years time, AI film production will be here. It’s almost impossible to answer that because it’s moving so quickly. Yeah, yeah. You know, like, um, if you ask me, you know, what we can do today back in January? Like, I just look back on the last twelve months we’ve had and that evolution has just been like unprecedented. You know what we can do in these unlocks? So I almost can’t even imagine the next twelve months, you know. But what I do know is we’re going to continue to be able to tell stories we’ve never been able to tell before better, faster, more efficient and cheaper. And that’s a really exciting space for creativity, because for us, it’s allowing us to unlock potential that we just couldn’t access before and tell these amazing stories and get these ideas off the ground. So yeah, it’s super exciting. And short is your answer. It’s kind of and in some would, some would say, oh, the tools are getting better. So therefore everyone’s going to be easier for everyone to do it. It’s like, no, it just means there’s more. There’s faster, more efficient F1 fighter jets. Yeah. Exactly that everyone has the keys to. But which is dangerous in the which is more dangerous for, for for people that don’t know what they’re doing, but for for creative community, those who are adopting AI. And so that as, as I said, those AI, those film directors with ten plus twenty years experience, um, and creatives or both whatever, who are adopting those tools and taking the time, it’s not you can’t just learn it overnight. It’s used properly to use all the tools properly. Right. Um, spending like a good year to eighteen months, kind of at least kind of learning tools on top of your craft. Um, they’re the type of people who will benefit from it. And that’s why we’re kind of, you know, utilizing the best people on earth, um, to go on that same journey with us to get to that level of craft. And so it’s an exciting time for us because the better the tools get, the the the more efficient and more creative our roster can get and we can get with our roster as well, which is, you know, really amazing. You know, it’s an amazing place to be playing And, you know, like, let’s face it, the beast is out of the cage. AI it’s not going back in the cage. So it’s like, let’s embrace it. It’s here. Let’s use it as opposed to it using us. And that’s what we’re doing. Fantastic. Yeah. We’d love to do some quick fire rounds. Real quick questions to close things out. Um, you guys obviously have gone through a lot of leadership journey, and now you’ve founded your own organization, your own business. Um, what is the one thing that you might have done differently leading into kicking off your business? That if you look back here, I know it’s only six months or nine months ago, if you were like, oh, I wish we’d done that a little bit different, leading into what we just started. What would be that one thing? Do you know what? One thing. And it’s not far because I think we’ve pretty much nailed the timing. If if anything, I would we’ve had this idea for, you know, since Cannes Lions twenty four and then sitting there having a beer together into proper execution, you know, like and thinking about it, the plan and whatever, and finding the roster like, you know, from from January or whatever. Um, it would have been lovely the timing if we got in just before Google Vo3. Uh, yeah, just that’s the only thing. I mean, it’s only small things because it I mean, I know no one kind of thinks about it, but it’s like we didn’t launch this once Vo3 came out like and like we the ability to talk, we were like, it would have been nice to go. You did it. And then and then like, before all that slop came out. Yeah. You know, like. But I think, honestly, like, I wouldn’t change a thing. No, I would truly I think since that beer in can to today sitting with you guys today literally I look back and it’s been a roller coaster of fun. Um, you know, building this, you know, with Marcus, this brand building a production company that’s gone global. We didn’t think it would go global, but it went global overnight. Um, and honestly, I mean, to your point, I truly don’t think we could have launched eye candy any earlier than we launched. Maybe a week or two. Yeah, yeah. That’s right. That’s before the it’s it was you know that that close where you know while it’s been an idea in inception since that beer but we you know, we needed all these pieces of the puzzle to fall into place. And they the last piece fell in in, in May. Yeah. And we launched June. Yeah. So maybe two weeks earlier. But truly it’s been an amazing ride personally. Wouldn’t change it. You know, change a thing and it’s been fun. There’s a lot of people out there wanting to start their own businesses and start their own consultancies or build products. What would be the one advice you might give to someone doing that going on the journey? Just do it. Just gets out. Yeah. And there’s been like, I don’t know, I kind of feel like Kent’s probably the same. Like we’ve especially the last three kind of, uh, places we’ve probably both been at. It’s just kind of being part of helping build other agencies and you’re like, look back. And it’s like, why don’t I just do that myself? And it’s so true, you know, like you’ve been, you know, burning the midnight oil, kind of like working your ass off. And it’s for someone else’s bottom line, like you’re just working for a salary. It’s like, I could have done this, but, I mean, uh, you know, the silver lining is we did this at the right time when AI came because we couldn’t have timed this any better. So maybe that was just the training for the time for this to happen, to see the to see what’s coming. Exactly. Because it would have been a completely different business if I started this ten years ago, right? We wouldn’t we wouldn’t be able to do what we’re doing if we didn’t have the skills and experience of twenty plus years on under our belt, we wouldn’t, you know. So we’re properly utilizing, you know, our skills and experience to allow us to do what we’re doing today. But I guess in answer to your question, um, just do it, you know, like. Yeah, like it like it is the best thing we’ve ever done. You know, we often joke it’s the, you know, it’s the best idea we’ve ever had launching eye candy. And, you know, I remember the, the, you know, the night before we launched, you know, it was like a shit. Here we go. You know, like it’s it’s it’s done. It’s done literally, you know, boom on the press release and boom on the website going live. And it’s just like, oh. And then see what happens. It was kind of it was a big it was kind of daunting at first. Like, you know, like this isn’t like starting another advertising agency or another specialist PR agency or another specialist digital content, whatever. This is like an AI film production company with, you know, creative and film production company. No one has done that like in Australia. And to be honest with, you know, there was an article from the Little Black Book that, um, from the UK that was asked about kind of, you know, people in a similar space to us, kind of, um, you know, what they’d been doing over the last six, six to twelve months. And you know, how they ideating and what their ethos was and whatever. And we were the last of the, of the six. Um, and they looked for the very best in the world. And she’s she’s like when we talked talk through our experience, you know, of you know, award winning kind of creative and production and working with big brands above are bringing that into the film production space and our ethos, our production, um, you know, process, etcetera, etcetera. She’s like, wow, you guys have the most unique offering in the world in the commercial art and architecture. Sorry, sorry in marketing, commercial and marketing space.

Right. So, um, which is which was lovely to hear because like, we planted the flag as Australia’s first, but really we’re kind of like first in the world in terms of what we’re offering to market for, for, you know, I love that because that’s what we’re about as well. It’s like putting Australia on the map for something that’s new and different and like changing the traditional ways of working because people like, you know, like the content people are two man bands doing or, um, in the film space kind of, you know, hybrid production, all that sort of thing. And we do hybrid as well for, for production companies too. But there are more in the feature film space. But in terms of the commercial and marketing space, like it’s kind of, um, you know, we had the best offering and going to market with that was scary thing because it’s like no one’s done it. It’s like, so we were really pioneering the space. Yeah. Pioneering this this space completely, which is, which was kind of scary. But like we’re so proud of what we’ve done now. Like then not only starting our own thing, but also doing something that nobody has ever done before, like. And it’s kind of when we look back, we’re kind of constantly over our Google meets, give ourselves a little high five across the camera every now and then. That’s our little thing. It’s like like, yeah, yeah. Um, you know, like we like, we nailed another client. I was like, this is happening, man. Like, this is working like. And, um, and it’s only because of, you know, our combined experience and, like, our passion and like, what we want to bring to the world. It’s like all these things are coming together and it’s, you know, and it’s like, as Ken said, I wouldn’t have done this with anyone else, you know, besides Ken as well. Like, he’s finding it, finding a co-founder to, to bring things together. It makes the biggest difference. It really does. It’s a, you know, it’s a professional marriage, you know, like, you know, like having the partner spending more time than your partners. Totally. Yeah. People don’t realize that being on the same wavelength, good at work, being on the same wavelength and having the same vision, you know, it’s hard to find in someone. And when you do, it’s a really cool thing. Yeah, yeah. Well, guys, it’s been an amazing chat. I really appreciate your time coming here. Anything you want to last to shout out about the business or any prompts that you want to push, let’s make the impossible. Yeah. Love it. Thank you Marcus. Thank you Ken. Thank you. Thanks for having us read it here first. Thank you everyone. Cheers. See you the next one.